“The Sinatra Test” is a term coined by brothers Chip and Dan Heath, authors of the best seller “Made to Stick: Why Some Ideas Survive and Others Die“.
From the book, page 151:
In Frank Sinatra’s classic “New York, New York,”? he sings about starting a new life in New York City, and the chorus declares, “If I can make it there, I can make it anywhere.”? This is what is called the “˜Sinatra Test’ - an idea when one example alone is enough to establish creditability in a given domain. For instance, if you’ve got the security contract for Fort Knox, you’re in the running for any security contract (even if you have no other clients). If you catered a White House function, you can compete for any catering contract. It’s the Sinatra Test: if you can make it there, you can make it anywhere.
Adapting the Sinatra Test to the domain world, would calling a prospect and mentioning the domain name of your site (assuming it is a prime domain name) be enough to close a sale? When we first started FuneralHomes.com some 18 months ago I remember how calls used to be, it went something along these lines:
Sales: Hi, Brian speaking, I’m from FuneralHomes.com, the largest independent Funeral Home directory on the web
Funeral director: Ah, you are the internet, I heard of that!
Or
Sales: Hi, Brian speaking, I’m from FuneralHomes.com, the largest independent Funeral Home directory on the web
Funeral director: Don’t call here anymore
or
Sales: Hi, Brian speaking, I’m from FuneralHomes.com, the largest independent Funeral Home directory on the web
Funeral director: -hangs up-
Not once one of these funeral directors said to us “You have a GREAT domain name” or “This domain name must get massive type-in traffic” or “That domain must help you with SEO!”. Not once did it happened that a funeral director would say “Where do I sign up?” without us first going through our sales pitch, putting forward all our value offerings on the table, from tracking, to search engine ranking, search engine marketing, traffic numbers, growth numbers, strategy, mentioning other major paid advertisers in the directory, and so forth.
A prime generic domain name is not a replacement for a strong brand. In no way, shape, or form a prime domain name can compete with a well oiled sales machine and a well run business. It compliments a business, it can somewhat help, but far from being the responsible factor for the success of the business. Why then do some believe a prime domain name is a major part of the business? It’s the misconception that the success of some businesses run on prime generic domain names was largely due to their domain names. It is easy for us to look at businesses such as Hotels.com, Business.com, Rent.com, and even FuneralHomes.com and point out to what first come to mind, that these businesses “own the industry” because they own the prime domain names of the industry. What have we overlooked here then? We overlooked the actual business development, the millions invested, the executives running these business, the traffic purchasing, the brand building, technology, and so much more. In short, we have missed the execution part of the equation.
If the success of the above businesses was mainly because of their prime domain names then the conclusion would be:
The value of similar undeveloped prime domains should be in direct relation to the business value of developed businesses which are using similar facevalue prime domain names as their web addresses. For example, if we believe a prime generic domain name is largely responsible for the success of a business, say 50% responsible, then the undeveloped domain map.com, assuming it is of a similar facevalue to the domain maps.com, and that maps.com (the business) is a 400 million dollar company, then map.com (the domain) should be worth 200 millions. Does it make any sense to you? Not to me either.
Signing advertisers isn’t easy, running a business, as Darren Cleveland stated so well yesterday (comments area) is not for the faint at heart. When it comes to signing/retaining advertisers and running online and offline businesses, from our extensive experience, there’s so much more to it than owning a prime generic domain name. The conclusion is that even the best domain names do not pass the Sinatra Test. They are not the responsible factor to signing advertisers, they are not the responsible factor for successful businesses, not by a long shot.
Sahar
Hi Sahar
This is as much a question as a statement as I think you will have forgotten as much as I know of your industry.
I believe that the brand is all important once it has become an established brand name,
The most cost effective and sustainable way to do that is to initially register your generic domains in clusters in a chosen area of commerce ? It has always seem to me that generic domains are more powerful when each can offer unique content with the ability to support each others SEO, with the ultimate purpose to support a brand. Content will always be king…but only if users can find it and the generic domains ensure this without high long term marketing costs.
FuneralHomes.com FuneralArragements FuneralDirectors Bereavement SympathyFlowers …….. will support any chosen new brand name
Great post. Very inspirational.
A great domain can make the sales process a little smoother by giving some credibility to the organization. Of course the people give the ultimately credibility but a great domains helps if nothing else to make the sales pitch more memorable.
I’ll bet a great majority of those prospects your guy called on still remember the domain rather than saying “Where was that guy from again?”.
You’re basically saying that, “Well the domain name didn’t help sell on the phone so therefore the domain name itself is not that important.” Did you ever stop to think that the market for FuneralHomes.com is already dead?
Seriously, I’ll be in Florida in May and we should all get together again.
In September 1997, when I first started out, I made a phone call and said basically the same thing when I started monetizing BoyntonBeach.com. It went something like this:
Me: Hi, this is David Castello with BoyntonBeach.com. BoyntonBeach.com is the most popular and intuitive web site for Boynton Beach and I’d like to discuss promoting your Boynton Beach business on the site.
Business: Hmmm…hold on a second. “Yo Joey! Some guy’s on the phone representing BoyntonBeach.com! They want to promote us! OK, I’ll tell him!”
Nah, we’re not interested right now…
That was the first and last telephone solicitation I or anyone with CCIN ever made (think about it - have you ever replied to a phone solicitation?). No one at CCIN is allowed to solicit anyone via the telephone.
As you know from our success, there are obviously much, much better ways to sell. And YES (for the umpteenth time) the name plays a BIG part in selling. I should know because I was doing it myself from 1998 - 1999 when I was selling advertising in Palm Springs. How do I know? I could see the reaction in their faces when I told them I was representing PalmSprings.com.
And it’s not just Geodomains. We have started to monetize Whisky.com and yesterday had a major advertising agency tell me, “Well, I can’t see my client ignoring advertising with a name like Whisky.com.”
—-answer—-
David,
I would really not believe that in 98 local business owners understood anything about the value of a domain name. Hack, we can try this today if you wish, go to a business owner, state a prime domain, and look at their faces. What most likely you will see is a “doh” moment. The excitement you saw on their faces was most likely the response of dealing with a great sales person - you. Their excitement was a reflection of your excitement.
And as far as the telephone in sales, the telephone is still responsible to more sales today then any other method. I won’t tell you how to run your business however, I will tell you that by not using the telephone you are most likely missing on many multiples of what your sales numbers could have been.
Yea, when you’re in town, let’s get together. I’m sure will see you in Orlando and/or Roundtable?
Sahar
Thanks for reminding me I need to learn how to do ping-backs.
I believe that domains like Sex.com and NewYork.com pass the Sinatra test with flying colors and you don’t need much of a business plan, except for maximizing the revenue, maybe integrate your own bidding system for the ad requests coming in. For domains that do not pass the Sinatra test, indeed it is an uphill road to build the business underneath, but the slope is lesser for generic good domains.
—-answer—-
Since we own many prime domains more then anyone I wish that was the case. We also own and run a number of real world businesses with over 120 employees combined and from experience, when it comes to selling, a domain on its own won’t get you far. Take a look at some of the top parked domains out there, do you think anyone you call on to advertise has any idea of their value? Anyone you call on understand what “direct navigation” is? Business owners in the real world know very little about the internet and most likely absolutely nothing when it comes to domains. Hack, most reporters who suppose to do research before writing about domains know very little about them.
I would say sales pitch is a sales pitch is a sales pitch. Having a generic domain in your sales pitch is as good as having a made-up domain. It is not the domain that sells, it is the sales person.
Sahar
OK, not a generic, but still a great use of a domain!
I went to the play “Twelve Angry Men” (about a jury deliberation) and there was an ad in the playbill by the sponsoring law firm, Lathrup and Gage.
Anyway, what really intrigued me is the domain they were advertising: http://www.beentherewonthat.com/
Been There. Won That.
Sure enough, the minute I got home I took a look at their site to see what lawsuits they had won. I though that it was a VERY innovative marketing idea and a very creative use of a domain for a 120 year old firm.
They always say that the Midwest is the last to catch on and I think that Kansas City is starting to take the bull by the horns! Hang on tight for the domain ride!!
Sahar:
Unfortunately, I have a scheduling conflict for both this upcoming Roundtable and TRAFFIC.
Yes, your assessment that the client’s reaction was partially due to my excitement in 1998 is correct, but only to a certain degree. The site’s ability to generate reveue for our Palm Springs clients has always been its best selling point and I credit the name PalmSprings.com as a huge factor. How do I know? Because in 1998-1999 I often came face-to-face with the sales reps from TheDesertSun.com, PalmSpringsLife.com, etc. Many times the client would have us all in the same room. I would use the power of the name PalmSprings.com in my sales pitch and I could see the tide start to turn in my direction. And even though the other sales reps had the established local reputation and glossy press kits, I beat them many more times than I lost. In fact, many times having the name PalmSprings.com was the only advantage I had over them. You also have to realize that I’ve been in sales a long time and I can easily tell what makes a difference. Having that name in my sales arsenal gave me a distinct edge (or I would have stopped using it). The exact sales strategies I used in 1998 are used today by everyone on CCIN’s sales team.
Interestingly, my brother saw my post last night and came to the same conclusions about FuneralHomes.com that I did. We’ve been analyzing other non-Geo sites because we can’t use the same sales strategy with our Geodomains like PalmSprings.com as we will for our Non-Geos like Whisky.com and Kennel.com. Every site has a different advertising market and when you start selling advertising you enter a whole new ballgame than PPC. When you start selling advertising you basically start to become your own advertising agency. And that is why we steer clear of telephone solicitations.
I would imagine Funeralhomes.com would be far harder and much more expensive to sell and run compared to the power of a geo domain like PalmSprings.com for a number or practical reasons.
Comparing domain for domain is not very realistic IMO, all premium domains are not created equal.
Both fantastic names but the Geo one would most definetly be my choice between the two.
I found your answer re Apr 11th, 2008 at 7:55 pm very suprising “I would say sales pitch is a sales pitch is a sales pitch. Having a generic domain in your sales pitch is as good as having a made-up domain. It is not the domain that sells, it is the sales person” So much intrinsic name value, search engine ranking or possible type in traffic
Blood, sweat and tears, 100 hour work weeks, unless you are lucky or very lucky.
Side tangent: I don’t think PalmSprings.com is a typical generic domain.
It’s got brand written all over it and spilling over the sides. And the initial core branding began along time ago, before Vint Cerf began surfing.
First time i’d ever heard of Palm Springs was in the early 70’s, and i’m from the backwoods of Canada.
my experience agrees with you wholeheartedly! a great domain is just the wind at your back but better there than having it in your face. LOL